Palpatine's strength is not that he is just so much more powerful than everyone. It is a combination of several things. Think about it:

1. If he was this all-powerful being, why would he bother with these apprentices? Why would he bother with Anakin?

2. Why even bother to lay out this elaborate plan to become emperor? If he was all-powerful, he could go anywhere, do anything, and not even bother with the government. Nobody could govern him, no matter who was in charge. Maybe he just really wants to be emperor? Then just walk into the senate and tell everyone "I'm the emperor and you are my bitches", and anyone who disagrees is toast.

3. Why not just walk into the jedi temple one day and lay everyone out?

Because he can't. He's obviously no pussy, but in order to reach the highest level, he needs the infrastructure of the government, the clone army, massive ships and battle stations, and a powerful apprentice to help him.

His power is rooted in two things: the element of surprise, and the support of the government. As far as most people are concerned, he is Abraham Lincoln: he made tough decisions when nobody else would, and kept the republic together. The Jedi, on the other hand, are trying to usurp him. Why would you do that to the guy who kept the republic together? Try explaining to the senate that he's really this evil jackass. Nobody would buy it.

When it comes to battle, he may or may not be on the same level with Windu. It does appear that he catches them by surprise when they come to confront him. 3 of them don't even know what hit them, so its not like he just overmatched them. It wasn't a straight up fight. He seems to have his work cut out for him with Windu, who is a very talented Jedi at the top of his game. Is it really surprising that he needs help to take him down?

As for Anakin being the one to kill him because of the prophecy... obviously, Palpatine does not think that bringing balance to the force means killing him. If he did, Anakin doesn't make it to AOTC.

My point is: If Palpatine was all-powerful, it would not take him 3 movies spanning 15 years to become emperor, and another 20 to finally get to the point where he doesnt need the senate anymore. It would take him about an hour. His strength is in his ability to be patient, build his infrastructure, and make his moves in a timely manner. His force/saber skills are considerable, but he's hardly the only one with talent.

For good storytelling, every villain or hero needs to have a legitimate threat. Superman needs Kryptonite.

So Tern has told us Mace fights Sids to winning stalemate, he has no saber, just lighting which can be blocked. So if Anakin doesn't step in Sids is toast, it's just matter of time, I like it. Mace wins but gets betrayed, by a fellow Jedi, who just called him Master too.

With the super bowl coming up, I'll use a football analogy:

Palpatine is Tom Brady. Maybe not talented enough to overwhelm everyone physically, by himself, but he doesn't get rattled and he doesn't make mistakes. On top of that, any mistakes that you make against him will be taken full advantage of. And while he may not have the most talent, he's not just some scrub off the street either.

On the other side, all the Jedi do is make mistakes. They keep trying to hide the fact that they don't really know what's going on, and Palpatine knows this, and uses it to his advantage. He's got them running around in circles and using everything they do against them.

What Palpatine is doing draws from charismatic dictators throughout history. The fact that he is a powerful sith really isn't even an issue, other than when dealing with the Jedi.

At least I hope this is how it is, because if he was an all-powerful being, or anything close to it, that would be incredibly stupid and uninteresting.

EDIT: another thing to consider...

Does Anakin really kill Palpatine in the end? Technically, he does, thus fulfilling the stupid prophecy, but if Luke just does the Mohammed Ali rope-a-dope for a little while longer with Vader, they all go down with the death star. I'm pretty sure Palpatine would not survive the death star blowing up while he was on it.

Palpatine wants Luke, Anakin, etc. to think that he is all-powerful. After all, that is the appeal of the sith. They think that ultimately, they will become all-powerful. In the end, Anakin/Vader realizes its all bullshit and it won't get him anywhere.

I think we can get it on our own without any sports references thank you.

It's bad enough we have to sit here & see that horrible baseball player mugshot or I mean picture.

Please in the future can we leave out any sporting references in this board?

I',m sure that NFL.com would happily accept your membership if they have a board.

Exclude sports references? It's like deja vu all over again!

What do you care if I make a sports reference or not? How could it possibly affect you?

Do I sense one of those geeks who hates sports just because he sucks at them?

And while the analogy did suck, I pretty much agree.

Well, Mace doesn't kick his ass. If you recall, Samuel Jackson said he had alot of defensive manuevers in his fight.

So I could see Palpatine driving Mace back for most of the fight until he breaks the window and then his saber. Then he blasts him with lightning, and it seems like it's a stalemate until Sidious falls to his knees... is he faking? Who knows, who cares.

Patriots by 10.

It's all part of Palpatines plan I'm sure, he is just playing the fool as this is his golden moment to convert Anikan.

Now, Now.. Lets not get back to the situation I had with Dr. stuperpants.

There was some sarcasm in that post.

But as far as the Manny pic I still hate it. Just my opinion.

How is it I can hurt so may feelings with so little words?

Plus I did play sports & was an average player. Hell just went snowboarding in Tahoe on Sunday.

And I stand by my point -- if Mace dominates Sidious, it hurts the film.

What is the real word on Palpatine's face?

Is it because he's really old and using the Force to mask his appearance?

Or does something happen to him to make him appear this way? I could have sworn I read something that indicated that Yoda throwing back lighting did it (that seems unlikely; nothing happened to Luke or Anakin when they were bombarded; although I guess they didn't have lightning returned to them).

And I would agree with you, Dark Shape.

On a side issue to all of this, as it was mentioned, I don't think the purpose would be to show how close they came to avoiding Palpatine's years of tyranny. There is an arrogance to Mace that could never be rewarded. He takes it upon himself to assasinate Palpatine - he decides that Palpatine's life is his to take, trial or no trial, proof or no proof. No procedure, no due process - an illegal execution. This isn't something that has been brought up in terms of Jedi beliefs but any time we've seen actual Jedi kill people it's usually been in a kill or be killed situation.

Sure, he's probably right about the courts but he could have taken him before what was left of the Council.

Mace could take him in but chooses to take it upon himself to stand as judge, jury and executioner.

Of course you could argue that Yoda and Ben would have been happy for Luke to kill Vader but, if Vader was pleading for his life, I doubt either would have urged Luke to decapitate him. I suspect Leia would never have straight-out murdered Tarkin either in the same situation.

More than that, the changing of the Greedo scene makes me think that Lucas would not condone such an execution. So I don't think that Mace was almost the hero by getting so close to killing him. He merely exposed the arrogance of the highest ranking Jedi - he was as responsible for the downfall of the Jedi as every other Jedi. He was no hero.

Dogg.

Sidious had just killed three of Mace's comrades. He had every right to take out the biggest threat in the galaxy.

About Mace owning Sidious- the spoiler doesn't support that, what Sam Jackson said aout the fight doesn't support that (lots of moves, mainly defensive), at least until they break through the window.

Well according to the spoilers he is on his knees pleading for mercy. There are good reasons why this would not be considered a 'clean kill' in the real world.

Han's life was in more danger than Mace's during his encounter with Greedo and Lucas saw fit to amend that because it wasn't a clean kill. You can say he had every right to do it because of what? Revenge for killing the three comrades? Is revenge a fitting motive for killing a man on his knees? Do you think Lucas wants us to think that revenge is enough? Or is it that he might kill more people? Not on his knees pleading for his life he won't.

Of course we know what Palpatine is capable of but at that moment Mace has no right to kill him without due process. Had it been during the battle (as with Maul) that would be entirely different.

Dogg.

I strongly suspect Mace knows Palpatine's simpering is an act. He'd already pulled one stunt that wound up with three councilmembers dead. I agree that Mace is within his rights to do what he feels is necessary. After all he is authorized (as leader of the Jedi) by the Senate to protect the laws of the Republic.

I also suspect that we'll have to reevaluate Lucas's moral lessons after viewing ROTS. It may be that Lucas wants Han's morality to be more black-and-white in the face of the ambiguousness of the PT. I'm taking a wait-and-see approach there.