This sums up my views as well.

Can't be bothered to synchronize the look of all of the lightsabers in a single movie - but can add rocks in front of R2-D2.
Can't fix the flipped images of Obi-Wan in TPM and Boba Fett in ROTJ - but can paste new dialogue for Vader in ROTJ.
Can't integrate the important Yoda/Qui-Gon scene in ROTS - but can add new Ewok eyes.

It's like a piece of software with a few obvious, annoying, and easily reproducable bugs and instead of fixing them, the developer insists on adding new features that weren't asked for in the first place.

Yeah, it's that inconsistency that drives me crazy. What's the deal with that? It makes no sense. Well, I'm buying this set anyway, and I'll probably write a review of it here or somewhere, but still, I don't understand the inconsistency.

When was any change asked for?

So, basically, Star Wars = the iPhone Facebook app.

Every update actually makes it worse than the last one...

like i said yesterday, if this leak is the real article LFL should be ashamed of themselves. they should be shamed for LYING to fans and most of all they should be ashamed for not doing their fucking jobs properly.

and i hate people saying they gave themselves wiggle room in the article. no they didn't.

"with the dimming of the lightsaber cores throughout the trilogy, even to the point where Luke's lightsaber aboard the Millennium Falcon shifted from blue to green in Episode IV. "We're trying to get back to the intention of the original film experience," says Huebler. "That's really what's going on with the lightsabers. You want that hot white core, and it was just right for film, but on video, that was dampened."

Issues such as these have been corrected,

AGAIN

Issues such as these have been corrected,

what a pack of lazy cunts at ilm. 3 levels of qc my dick. maybe these idiots should fucking watch a youtube video of a fan edit to understand what a fucking blue saber is supposed to look like.

I guess we can give thme another 7 years to "work on this" but my guess is in 2018 they'd look the same, except by then they'll have added in palpatine break dancing and luke doing cartwheels on endor with the ghost of biggs

That's the thing - they clearly haven't been lazy, they've been very busy... it's just what they have been busy doing that is the problem. There are just too many decisions been made post-post-production here without the focus or pressure that comes with a normal movie production schedule.

In the end, the decision-making process that resulted in these changes doesn't actually matter, only what comes across when watching these films now - and it reeks of things being done simply because they could be done, whether that is true or not.

here's a link to a very good page that shows all the changes with side by side comparisons up until the DVD release from A New Hope. In case you've forgotten just what these things use to look like!

http://www.dvdactive.com /editorial/

Don't forget that they spent time fixing the reversed SD bridge at the end of Empire.

The part that bothers me the most is that most of the "making of" documentaries focus almost entirely on the technical challenges. Models, CGI, editing, etc. They all end with cheerleading celebrating their own excellence and awesomeness. Christ, one of the web sites for this release had an interview with Matt Wood crowing about completely redoing the ANH soundtrack. Solving technical issues is what ILM does!

That's why the flipped images bother me so much. In the case of the Obi-Wan scene in TPM, how hard would it be to simply cut his braid from one side and move it to the other? Or cut and CGI? Likewise with Boba Fett's rangefinder in ROTJ. Would the time and effort be more expensive than adding Ewok eyes? A new panning shot for Jabba's door?

I'm sure you'd get some complaints about how some aspect was "obvious" and unfinished ("Ewan's mole is on the wrong side!" and "The paint ops on Boba's helmet is clearly wrong for that side!") but the majority of us would be satisfied if not completely happy for the fixes.

And R2's flipped face in a few shots here and there. That would be very easy to digitally fix, while keeping the intent of the flipped shot intact.

I get the sense that Lucas & Co. probably just think that people won't notice things like that.

They could always just hide it behind a rock.

My god, I've moved onto ANH now, and I've just watched that scene. To be confronted with Ben's new scream and the bizarre CGI rock in such close succession - it really is terrible stuff.

So how does that work? How does he come out? Or does he just suddenly appear with the new rock suddenly disappearing?

That's what I think is so hilarious! Their making of videos show us how they spent time to show us how they fixed some seemingly nitpicky detail.

Like a far away shot of Count Dooku with his head half turned away from the camera that they mapped Christopher Lee's face onto the stunt double. Or ETs in TPM or the Millenium Falcon in ROTS. "Oh see this costume had a wrinkle in it so we fixed it with CGI!"

They've taught us to notice seemingly inconsequential things! Lucas has a bizzare philsophy between "good enough" and "get this 100% correct".

Hey, Tread, wait 'till yiou notice that as soon as R2 is OUTSIDE the cave the rocks (Joker grabs Lucas's head and SLAMS it into the table) "TADA! They're gOooonnne.". And, Bandersnatch, yeah, pretty much that's it - shots of R2 hiding in the cave, then suddenly a shot of him not being in the cave anymore.

It's exactly the same cuts as before, so one minute he is in the cave, the next he is in front of it, we never have actually seen him leave. Except now, the rock formation has changed once Artoo moves in front of it.

Another thing I felt too - apart from the fact that the quirky interaction of the shadow on Artoo makes it painfully obvious as a CGI addition - something about it being there also upsets the rhythm of those cuts. I swear, it seems like we keep cutting back to Artoo over and over again to draw attention to the fact that he is HIDING BEHIND A ROCK, whereas before, yes, he was supposed to be hiding, but the cuts were just involving him as a concerned spectator, while his master was getting mauled.

Honestly, it may seem like I am overreacting to a simple change but it really does fukck with the pacing of those cuts. I don't know why, but it does - before it was fluid because it was obvious we were seeing the Sandpeople ransacking the speeder and were aware of Artoo observing this.

Now it plays like: Sandpeople are laying Luke down... Artoo is hiding... They're going over to the speeder... look, Artoo is still hiding... They are going through the stuff in the speeder... peek-a-boo, there he is again... and that's before that god awful scream, and the cuts carry on that way even after Ben arrives. Weird.

Little details like that can make such a big difference. So maybe on one hand someone somewhere along the line has thought to themselves "Hey, why don't those Sandpeople go and grab Artoo - I mean, he must be worth something to them, and he hasn't picked a very good hiding spot, has he... I wonder if we could make him seem more obscured from there view." Which seems fair enough on paper, but in reality it is over-engineering a solution to a problem that wasn't really ever there... and you are tied to the work the editor had already done before you start making that change.

You have to step back at some point and look at the scene as a whole, and that doesn't seem to be happening with any of these additions. It's like ticking a load of boxes - "right, problem fixed, move on to the next one" - but at no point has anyone gone back over these things and looked at the bigger picture with the eye of an editor.

Even seemingly subtle little things like that can fuck with the whole flow, which, more often than not can actually be more important in a scene than the "little details".

Have these been confirmed as the actual final Blu rays?

Are you saying you checked the editing of the sequence, Treadwell? Becuase watching it I was SURE that we were cutting back to R2 far more often than we did originally, and it was getting really annoying.

I'll check again...


No the cuts are the identical. See what I mean - it completely changes the flow of the scene, and makes it seem like there are more back and forth cuts from Artoo to his POV, even though it is exactly the same as it always was in that respect.

Hey everyone, haven't posted in a while.

I've been seeing the leaks, etc. and so I was able to watch a bit of A New Hope and honestly? I shut it off... I got to Mos Eilsey and I was thinking "I can either finish watching this or go to sleep" and I decided my time would be better spent sleeping.

I think what leaked is legit. I'm disappointed but I'm not surprised... I'm also not surprised I'm disappointed. This is after me scouring video stores in NYC to try and find an underground copy for sale early. I'm a pretty rabid fan and a pretty loyal one.

To be honest, I was skeptical from the get-go about this release.. the box art looked absolutely awful, there didn't look like there was much "care" in designing and packaging these discs...and the closeup official release shots of the box art make it look even worse.. I guess Lucas was going for a "storybook" type of look with this.. the thing is.. there have been probably literally tons of artwork produced for both the prequel and original trilogy.. and simply using some half-assed rough painting look in my opinion doesn't give this packaging the "care" that the movies deserve.

If there is one BluRay box set that fans, cinephiles and home theater people have been clamoring for.. it's hands down the Star Wars movies. I give Lucas credit for selling the box set at a relatively low price point to be affordable to everyone, but seriously, a cardboard box with some crappy artwork? That's the best they can do?

In terms of the movies themselves... there has been a huge PR push to show how Lucasfilm has gone to extra lengths to clean everything up for BluRay and of course everyone knew that there would be obligatory tweaks to the movies. The initial buzz can be summed up for the most part as "We were originally skeptical, but these discs are actually surprisingly good" and "worth it for the bonus features" but it seems that the movies themselves were not given the "care" that we, as fans, would expect.

It looks like they are the HD broadcasts tweaked for BluRay with a few extra tweaks, which is fine, but that doesn't make for the best marketing campaign.

When I was a kid, it seemed that Lucas and ILM were masters of their craft. Innovate, envelope pushing, experimental. Star Wars is a really really good movie, The Empire Strikes Back is a GREAT movie, but by Return of the Jedi it started to become obvious that George Lucas had begun to lose steam and lose interest in the universe that he created, and the work suffered.

The work continued to suffer with the Ewok adventures, Willow, Howard the Duck, etc. and the prequel films, which were completely financed and controlled by George Lucas and no-one else, show the aesthetic and discipline with which George Lucas has accustomed himself to working.

The rumor is that the most uttered phrase by George Lucas nowadays tends to be "good enough". Whatever comes in the box on September 16 is more than likely not the best it can possibly be, but simply "good enough". All evidence and all articles, PR releases have supported this "good enough" attitude.

What I find fascinating is that there is still this idea that George Lucas has another trick up his sleeve ... and to be honest I find myself thinking "maybe George is going to use the profits from these movies to finance the 3D versions of the prequels and original trilogies and then they'll be AWESOME" but honestly, this is the best that we're going to get, no point in hoping or wishing for more.

It's because it draws attention to itself by the nature of the change, which then draws you out of the movie.

If Vader had said the noooooo's back in 83, we'd all accept them by now. But not only is it a needless change, it draws you right out of the moment because its so distracting.

good point, you are right. they've put their efforts into dumb shit. personally i would have been happy with the 2004 edit and just basic fixes.

thats it. none of the changes made are worth it and the lack of consistent fixes ruined the whole thing

I wish I was a doctor, specializing in suicide prevention.

I'm kind of happy at the universal hatred this set is getting but it's unfortunate that it'll still make a wad of cash.

The only way to make LFL change is by making this release a flop, and it won't be. Credible media sources won't pan it or ask the tough questions out of fear that they'll lose access.

Matt Wood - if you do read the boards like you say you do - you're a fraud.

the fear people must have on a daily basis that work at LFL has to be insane-

"I hate these changes but I'm still buying these."

You realize you're part of the problem, right? It's because of fans like you that George knows he could literally wipe his ass with these films and you would still buy it.

I have to chime in on this.

One one hand, you get the movies on Blu-Ray. You can't get better quality than that. On the other hand, the movies are botched. The way I see it, the movies themselves don't mean to me what they used to because they've been desecrated. I'm buying the set mainly for the extras, to play scenes once in a while, and I can cringe and watch the movies beginning to end.

Buy the damn things used then. Or download the extra content.

I just don't understand someone buying an admittedly sub-par product. You guys do understand the concept of dollar voting, right?

Dollar voting doesn't work when a handful of sheep don't buy something, but eleventy billion other people do. It's like pissing in the wind.

It does work when a company like HP puts out a shitty product and nobody buys it (Touchpad).

Reposting my repost of DoubleSith's repost of the NYTIMES post:

• NYTIMES.com: On Wednesday - a press representative for Lucasfilm confirmed that this change will be included in the Blu-ray release, writing in an e-mail: “Yes — Darth says NO"

So the solution is to just buy them anyways, despite the fact that you know they're shit? I'm sorry, I just don't get it. I guess it comes down to whether you think there is $100 worth of extras on there. Me, looking at the recycled docs turnarounds, and admittedly intriguing deleted footage, I think there's more like a single movie's purchase price worth of stuff, so I'd probably go $30 for the extras max. But you gotta suit yourself of course.

Thanks for showing me the light.

I just ordered a 2nd copy on Amazon.

See, here's the thing. I don't like the changes, but there's a lot more on the box set I'd like to see, and I still have the DVDs if I really, REALLY need to watch the end the way I want. Having the movies on Blu-Ray is a win.

And believe me, I've dropped more money on more Star Wars stuff over the years. More stuff than YOU can imagine. This is nothing....

I suppose this is the version we are getting in 3D in a few years? or should we expect George sticking his dick in the soup one more time?

Look, I think I was pretty clear there; the transfers are crap, even you aren't arguing this anymore, are you Bandersnatch?

No more suggestions that it's all a big misunderstanding because of the magical "compression"? Okay, good. Now on top of that the best thing which can be said about the changes is that at least some of them are essentially harmless but totally inane, but the bulk are grossly offensive, Yeah?

So this all comes down to do you want to pay a hundred bucks for the extras. I won't, as I've owned most of the documentaries before, and the remaining is just not worth a hundred I could spend on something better....like, I don't know...ANYTHING. If you think it's worth your scratch, then that's fine, knock yourself out, and frankly I'm too exhausted by the last day worth of disappointments to have much bile left in me to argue anymore.

I'll just wait till I'm senile and will buy the latest version then. I'm sure the transfers will be better, the 3D technology will allow to touch or even move around objects in the films, and there even might be some kind of technology that will allow switching between the various versions in real time.

If the world ends before that, then too bad I guess.

I was joking.

Lighten up, fuzzball.

I don't know - I can imagine quite a lot.

The focus has, understandably, shifted away from everything else this set has to offer.

But, yeah, I feel no shame in admitting I have been waiting to see some of those deleted scenes since I was a child. And the behind the scenes stuff, although seemingly presented in little bite-sized chunks, seems interesting at least.

So those are big, big selling points for me - I mean, let's be realistic, was anyone who disapproved of the 97 SEs ever going to be buying this box set for the actual movies? Not me.

If the choice was between:

A hi-def version of the original theatrical cut of Star Wars that was blighted by the same colour issues that have been present since the DVD release

OR

A hi-def version with perfect colour, but where Jawas fell from Rontos and Han walks around a CGI Jabba and stands on his fucking tail...

I'd take the former every time. No contest.

As it turns out. We are not even getting the latter, because the colour issues have barely been resolved AND there is even more CGI and audio vandalism to add insult to injury. So a double-fail on the actual worst-case scenario for me.

So, given that only a lunatic would have ever even hoped that the unaltered versions of the movies might make it onto this set, the movies themselves never even figured in any "I'm buying this set" consideration I might have been having.

I don't have it on preorder or anything, but yeah, as someone who has loved Star Wars since the 70s, buying these just for those deleted scenes and selected other extras is a very realistic option still to me.

As someone who does just that, allow me to make this my 1st post on a board I've only discovered this morning:

Suicide prevention relies on keeping the person alive. That's the number 1 goal. Once they're not dead ('cause, you know, treatment doesn't work on dead people), the rest is about building a life worth living. "Star Wars" is part of my life worth living.

Pain is unaviodable, so there's gotta be some practice of acceptance. That's not to say a person should roll over and cave in, but there's some stuff you just can't change, and fighting an un-fightable pain is like a straight path into the Pit of Carkoon.

"Star Wars" is a HUGE part of who I am, on more levels than I can explain, and it has been since 1977. I continue to enjoy the heck out of it. It's why I'm me, it's why I'm a Psychologist, it's why I like the music I like, and so on... AND there are still things in the original trilogy that I never really liked. I was never a big fan of Ben's chat with Luke in "Jedi." Good storytelling is about showing, not saying.

I wasn't all that keen on how long it takes for Vader to grab Palpy and toss him over the railing. It just felt a few beats too long. Then when the movies were tweaked (and tweaked again) there were a few more things I wasn't crazy about.

So I practice acceptance, because I can't change any of this.

Truth be told, I'd pay to watch a half hour of Walrusman and Greedo playing ping-pong, and then I'd buy the Blu-Ray just to see the ping-pong game from a different angle. I'd listen to Greedo's commentary. And clearly, the folks on this board feel just as much passion about the "Wars" as I do. Wouldn't we be buying this anyway, just for the deleted scenes?

But you know what? This isn't the last time we're gonna buy these movies, and it isn't the last time we'll be pissed off by them, and it shouldn't matter either way.

I'm still enjoying the fact that I can watch "Star Wars" at home. On videotape.

Ewoks with functional eyelids, inconsistent lightsaber colors, and vocal Vader won't diminish the impact of watching the Tantive IV and the Devastator fly overhead.

They didn't add digital tears to Han's eyes when he says "I know" in response to Leia's "I love you." I can probably groove over the rest. And when I want to watch the movies that changed my life, I'll watch the DVDs that we got roughly 5 years ago. This? This is just more ping-pong.

It depresses me that I will never have a truly "great" version of the OT in hi-def. This release is a giant mess of "what should have been" (as opposed to "what could have been").

What's funny is that the prequel set by default actually becomes the less infuriating trilogy for a change. I'd like George to digitally destroy the droid foundry sequence and all the 3PO hijinks though. I'd accept renaming Episode I "JAR JAR'S GREAT ADVENTURE" if it meant fixing the music and idiotic "comedy" of the PT.

Nicely said.

And welcome to this most dysfunctional end of the internets.

I know, right? I was just thinking that bizzaro thought last night, reflecting that the one set I'm thinking about picking up is the prequel trilogy, as I erased my PT HD rips in preparation for the BR set. Hell, maybe that was the master plan all along: "See, the PT outsold the OT or saga sets! People want the PT!"

Although, no offense, but I'd be REALLLY skeptical of a psychologist who told me the center of his life was Star Wars...maybe want to hold that tidbit in reserve until after they're off the ledge

Thanks!

Aw, dude... I moderate a KISS message board; you've not seen dysfunctional until you've read 16 pages of Tommy Thayer versus Ace Frehley.

"Well that's a foolish wish. If you're wishing, why not wish for doctor's wage without having to do the actual work..."

Then I can show them the 87 minutes of Wookiee domesticity from the "Holiday Special" with the knowledge that they're safe from self-inflicted harm.



Ah, a Keith Moon look-alike and his little buddy in the swamps of Krull!

The Star Wars Saga on Blu-ray: The best 3 discs for the cost of 9 made available yet.

In the light of things I actually plan on keeping my 2004 DVD set. I was gonna get rid of them but I doubt I will now. Even though I am still buying the Blu-Ray set, I think I can basically ignore the changes and just watch the films. As I said before I'm more interested now in the deleted scenes and other bonus material from the set rather than the films themselves.

Simon Pegg via Twitter pretty much sums up my feelings;

"Always loved Vader's wordless self sacrifice. Another shitty, clueless, revision like Greedo and young Anakin's ghost. What a fucking shame."

Young Anakin's ghost vexes me still. Isn't the whole idea that Anakin's redemptive act takes place the moment he saves Luke from the Palpster? If so, wouldn't we be seeing Sebastian Shaw? ISN'T THAT WHAT THEY MEAN BY "RETURN OF THE JEDI?"