May 25, 2005

200 Posts, 0 Emoticons. Modest, but respectable.

MF.com is the only Star Wars-based messageboard I've ever read, or contributed to... minus a small stint for about 10 minutes a year ago on TFN. (Forgive me, Lord, I knew not what I did.) But it's time to move on.

Thanks Tern, SI, DP, and all our benefactors, for everything. Conspicuous thanks to CoGro, and others who shall remain nameless.

And with your indulgence, one final set of thank yous:



Dear George,

Thank you for Star Wars. Thank you for that memorable day in 1977, when I realized I was to spend my life pursuing music and filmmaking. Thank you for the clarity of purpose I've known every day since. You taught me the power of film.

Thank you for documenting the early days of ILM - those wonderful videos of matte artists rotoscoping hundreds of frames on celluloid by hand, painstakingly, one at a time. You taught me dedication to my craft.

Thank you for taking on the Hollywood system, and beating them at their own game. You did it your way, and the world is better for it. You taught me independence, and defiance.

With your rebelling British crew, your make-up man taken ill, and your dwindling money, Star Wars was never what you wanted it to be - fortunately for the rest of us. Thank you for teaching me that as artists, we may not know everything about what moves people. You taught me to set my ego aside, and listen to my audience.



And thank you, George, for abandoning so much of what once made Star Wars great.

With every lingering establishing shot and ship fly-by, I remembered your words about how little was needed to set a story. When the enlightenment of the Force was traded in for a blue-blood aristocracy; when glorious set design traded for sterile CG backdrops; when the riveting charisma of Harrison Ford was traded for the slapstick antics of Jar Jar Binks, you reminded me of the fundamentals of drama. You taught me to remember the basics.


Thank you, George, for bowing to the pressure of being a visonary... of doing visionary-type things, whether they were a good idea or not. Thank you for seeding a generation of apologists with impossibly low expectations. Thank you for believing your own press, and surrounding yourself with the most talented people on Earth, who publicly laughed at all your jokes, and privately wondered what the fuck had happened. You taught me the danger of success.


With your destruction of the original versions of the films that got you here, that changed the world and entertainment forever, thank you for showing me the perils of revisionism. Thank you for teaching me the true nature of artistic contribution; that my art is not for my own indulgence, but for those whose lives would be affected by it. If nothing else, you reminded me, "if it ain't broke, don't fix it." You taught me to let go.



For 28 years, I have lived every day of my life connected to, or affected by Star Wars in some way. In my art, which is my life, you began by teaching me what to do, and ended up showing me exactly what not to do. You are the Light Side, and you are the Dark Side. So be it... that, in the end, is balance.

As I type this, I have in my office two life-size stormtroopers, a life-sized Darth Vader and two life-sized R2-D2s. I have replicas of seven lightsabers, a Jedi training remote, a thermal detonator, the Emperor's cane, a stormtrooper rifle, Princess Leia's gun, and the gun Han Solo used to shoot Greedo first. My walls are adorned with 6-foot-by-8-foot, first generation movie posters for Star Wars, Empire and Jedi, rescued from an Italian movie theater. The soundtracks for the Original Trilogy exist in every media format I have access to, and the piano bench is literally overflowing with Williams scores. These are the icons of my inspiration and my passion, and they're with me every day of my life. One day, they will be shared with my children, not only as a reminder of their father, but as part of an ongoing legacy... the passing down from generation to generation of one of the great stories of popular culture now permanately imbedded in the annals of world cultural history.

For 28 years of all that is Star Wars...

Thank you.



Farewell...


_Mike Verta

Somehow I felt insulted after reading this. Thank you mikverta.

I hope you won't be very disappointed if George will not read your letter, he is not the same man that he was 28 years earlier lately. You see, he keeps missing stuff, sometimes the painfuly obvious stuff too, maybe he could even miss your big, reddish countdown.

Take it easy Mike,

Good luck, and may the force be with you.

the force will be with you, always.

I dont really know you but farwell.

I hope sometime in the future Lucas will change some things for the prequels to make it better than it is now. Maybe he should hand it over to someone else to do some editing.

Thank you, mverta, for teaching me that I am a know-nothing apologist who has no creative ability whatsoever. Thank you for trashing three movies which I happened to like very much. Thank you for needlessly and unintentionally raising my blood pressure every time I read one of your prequel-hating posts. You taught me it is okay to disagree with you.

I have only been here a short time, but I have to say I disagreed with about 95% of what you wrote. Still, your posts were entertaining to read, and I wish you success. I look forward to seeing your masterpieces someday. I also hope that someday, in the far distant future, mverta bashers and gushers will be endlessly debating the intricacies of your movies.

While Lucas is still an independant film-maker, he's not the same person as the fiery visionary from the 70's looking to blaze a trail right up Hollywoods ass. He's the aging single dad looking after his kids, running a billion dollar EMPIRE, a pioneer of digital film-making, all the while trying to finish his epic story he so long ago began. 30 years is a long time between drinks to be sure, but for the most part he got it right and I'm just fucking content knowing he did finish what he set out to accomplish and he did it his own way, and IMO certainly ROTS is his crowning achievement.

you all act like its truly over

my ass

see you in a few years time when there making the next thing to do with star wars.

May the Force be with you, Mike.

it is as far as the movies are concerned. but hey, the other avenues they can take SW I'm all for, but nothing changes the fact this chapter is closed and this "my ass" business truly is "your ass".

See you around Mike. When I finish my cd I'll send you a free copy.

While I look forward to your creative output, if I never read another opinion from you, it'll be too soon.

Thank you, Mike Verta, from showing me true bitterness. I will do my best to stay away from it.

Who else is actually happy that, whatever their shortcomings might be, GL waited so many years between the trilogies? I don't think that a younger, happier, in love George who started with swashbuckling adventures of Luke Starkiller could have made such a dark, tragic and disturbing movie as ROTS. His ex-wife must have really left him heart broken...

Well, to be honest, I think that the single greatest reason that the "romance" in the PT is so lacking is because George hasn't gotten laid in about 20 years. But that's another topic.

No, it's because Portman sucked. And, corny dialogue aside, it suffered from comparison to Han and Leia. People wanted them to exchange witty remarks like in ESB and forgetting that it's two different stories and two different couples.

Natalie didn't write the script.

No, but she could at least try to show some emotion.

"Art is never finished, only abandoned."

Leonardo da Vinci


If you wanted to write a thank you letter to George, you could have typed it out and sent it here:

George Lucas
c/o Lucasfilm
P.O. Box 10228
San Rafael, CA 94912

Nah, "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" is cooler then Da Vinci, becouse so many people keep repeating it whenever possible, that it almost seems like it's saying something important.

The fact that this thread is bringing up less fond memories and more venom is perhaps telling.

Nothing is cooler than da Vinci.

How did it borrow from ROTK and Peter Jackson? Did Jackson invent something?

And isn't the fancy effect question a bit like asking why didn't George Washing just use bombers on the British?

With that, I return to the comparatively lucid world of stock analysis.

What people "want" from any film is to be convinced. The dialogue between Anakin and Padme regularly pulled people out of the moment. Instead of keeping the audience immersed in the relationship between two characters, it reminded them that they were watching an unconvincing performance from two actors. It has nothing to do with Anakin and Padme being different from Han and Leia. People have been convinced by screen romances before without having to compare them to the Star Wars OT.

Lucas is great with concepts, and the idea that Anakin and Padme were star-crossed, ill-fated lovers fits well within the larger framework of the PT. It's just that every time they shared an "intimate" moment, the audience was encouraged more toward laughter and mockery than any other reaction. There are teen romances playing out on TV that are more convincing.

I hate this kind of talking about movies, like they're some machines with obvious functions that one has to get working properly, in a certain way, to get cheers from the audience. People are often dissapointed just becouse something is different then what they're used to. Why should the reactions of the general public be seen necesserly as manifestations of human nature? I think that if a way of reasoning about any aspect of a movie is good it doesn't need backing up by how audience does or should react. I'm not saying there are actualy truly objective arguments that you could use to convince every smart enough person to your point of view about a film, these are always questionable I'm afraid, but discussing them in detail is always better then assuming what's natural for all (sane persons) to think and feel and what isn't (or if a romance followed the one true pattern of good romances or not).

Call me crazy, but I'd rather live with the danger of success Lucas has had than not be successful at all.

Look, there's a pretty obvious difference between someone delivering a line with real conviction and real emotion, and someone delivering that line like they're reading it from a cue card just offscreen. Learning and discerning this difference doesn't require a level of aesthetic sophistication unreachable by most humans; it comes through fairly common exposure to a common medium. Romantic adventure fiction isn't Proust. What works, works; what doesn't, doesn't, and in popular media this conclusion is usually arrived at by consensus opinion. The fact that the clumsily handled romance in the PT is an overwhelming target of most of the negative criticism of the movies suggests not that it's a special form of storytelling that people aren't accustomed to, but rather simply that it doesn't work very well.

I wasn't trying to make a point that Star Wars is so artsy, so sophisticated that it requires special treating (although I think you underestimate Lucas ambitions in that matter). Popular media or all media, I still can not understand, how can you be so sure that you know, what works and what doesn't in movies, in romantic adventure fiction, perheps not in Proust. That you think the consensus opinion is constant, doesn't change. That you believe that you have such a good idea of it, becouse you red many reviews stating the same things, talked with many people about it and a lot of them agreed on those things. Most people state their opinions independently of any strong, outside influences and never change them, right?

I'm not saying there are no people with strong opinions of their own or that a true general consensus is unreachable on anything, all I'm saying is that stating something is so and so, becouse most people think like that, makes a lausy argument if you want to criticise something properly in a serious discussion and not just dump something or someone you don't like.

Sorry if I got something wrong, assumed to much about how you think or oversimplified anything you wrote. Feel free to correct me.

Did I say that the dialogue is great? I'm just saying that Natalie has also something to do with the viewers not being convinced. And yes expectations do matter. Otherwise we wouldn't hear complaints like "why there's no character like Han Solo in the PT" or "why they don't have that witty banter like Han and Leia".



I can't say I disagree. But let me remind you that I was talking about ROTS and in that movie had no problem with their relationship. But anyway, I wasn't talking about the romance in PT. I said that the OT Lucas wouldn't have made ROTS the way it is, dark and sad story.

Maybe not, but you DID say "people are often dissapointed just becouse something is different then what they're used to," and I don't think it's a mistaken inference on my part that you're saying the audience just didn't understand that the romance wasn't meant to be laughed at.

If the message doesn't get across to the larger majority of the audience, then my personal feeling is that that's the fault of the messenger, not the audience, regardless of his ambitions. As a moviegoer, it's not my responsibility to react to his intent, but only to what he delivers.



If there were engaging protagonists, you wouldn't hear those complaints. The movies didn't need a Han Solo clone, but they did need someone for the audience to identify with. And while I enjoyed the PT for the most part, there never really were any such characters.

And please, enough Portman bashing. The writer wrote awkward dialogue and the director didn't elicit a strong performance -- and when those two roles are fulfilled by the same person, that suggests a far different problem than the weakness of any particular actor.

"And thank you, George, for abandoning so much of what once made Star Wars great.

With every lingering establishing shot and ship fly-by, I remembered your words about how little was needed to set a story. When the enlightenment of the Force was traded in for a blue-blood aristocracy; when glorious set design traded for sterile CG backdrops; when the riveting charisma of Harrison Ford was traded for the slapstick antics of Jar Jar Binks, you reminded me of the fundamentals of drama. You taught me to remember the basics.


Thank you, George, for bowing to the pressure of being a visonary... of doing visionary-type things, whether they were a good idea or not. Thank you for seeding a generation of apologists with impossibly low expectations. Thank you for believing your own press, and surrounding yourself with the most talented people on Earth, who publicly laughed at all your jokes, and privately wondered what the fuck had happened. You taught me the danger of success.


With your destruction of the original versions of the films that got you here, that changed the world and entertainment forever, thank you for showing me the perils of revisionism. Thank you for teaching me the true nature of artistic contribution; that my art is not for my own indulgence, but for those whose lives would be affected by it. If nothing else, you reminded me, "if it ain't broke, don't fix it." You taught me to let go."

I agree, but I don't think the nature of the story opens many possibilities for such character. They're all royalty, polititians and Jedi who don't talk like cool smugglers and live in a more civilised (and less colorful) time. Now if you say that he should have at least made them more likable I won't argue with you because ROTS is the only prequel where I felt consistently involved with the characters.



I actually like her in some other movies. But she does ruin most of Naboo scenes in AOTC for me. If I didn't feel like listening to that dialogue again at least I could watch it muted but not for her bored look. I just can't stand it.



Then how would it have helped the romance if AOTC was filmed, say, 25 years ago if Lucas stayed as a writer/director? ESB romance works well because Kershner is better at intimate scenes than Lucas and because actors were allowed to improvise. That's why I think it's ROTS that has benefited from Lucas being more mature person (keeping in mind that a lot of things in his movies are autobiographical)

Bye mverta, don't let the door hit your ass on the way out. Oh and you're a fucktard and I've never liked you. It's a shame I still have to deal with your pathetic ass on the RPF.

"Bye mverta, don't let the door hit your ass on the way out. Oh and you're a fucktard and I've never liked you. "


What Foxbat said.

Ah, how I pity stupid people. I wasn't even going to say anything for fear of showing your true retardedness in public, but that has to be one of the most naive statements I've EVER heard regarding Star Wars. And that says a fucking lot.

The heavy influence of Kurosawa on Star Wars is almost common knowledge in both the fan and overall film community, not to mention the numerous other influences that were stolen from other people and films.

Star Wars was original and visionary, but it took things from many, many films.


And Mike, I hope you have fun doing your movie thing, it was nice having you around here, I only hope you understand (as I sometimes think you do) that filmmaking is not a textbook, all movies have mistakes, and that despite how technically proficient a movie is, it can still suck something horrible without heart behind it. I'm sure you don't mean to, but sometimes you come off as slightly arrogant. Lucas does make mistakes, but watch enough student films, and I think you'll find your arguments flawed.

Even if Lucas DOES make mistakes that are first-year film school, those student films you refer to are, honestly, generally crap, and filled with many more mistakes. That's not to say that Lucas is God and Star Wars is unflawed, only that you come across as sometimes having real genuine bitterness, which real or not, comes across in your posts.

Best of luck though, it sounds like you have a dream job.

Right. This thread has been reopened and pruned. (fyi redialnumber has his-her own dedicated thread here - split from this one - since she is "special".)

mverta thank you and the other professionals here for lowering yourself by hanging out with us. I mean that both seriously and sarcastically.

I've been hoping that someone might delete one or two of his posts just to drop him down below 200. Hasn't happened though.

Yet.

jmaurice82 shrink that avatar



Yeah, she's special. Her myspace avatar link shows she's a guy:

http://www.myspace.com/00105